YES, more questions...

Discussion in 'Dairy Goat Info' started by mamatomany, Aug 23, 2008.

  1. mamatomany

    mamatomany New Member

    1,239
    0
    0
    Well, today I spent a while at a grade a dairy where there were over 400 goats for goodness sakes. The woeman I talked her ear off about my two girls and she did the "well if they were mine...." anyways she suggested I worm them yet again with ivermectin (which I did tonite) and in a week do the same and then the week after that the same. Three consecutive weeks. I was reading I think in 101 that the withdraw time is 40 days :crazy I will be milking these little ones for 2 whole months with not a single drop going into my babies mouths :crazy I did mention the quest wormer which I did and her response was it is for a 1,000 lb. horse, you can't guarantee that the 1cc or ml however it is done has any cydectin in it. It is not designed that way...thought I would throw that one out for comment too. SSSSOOOO do I wean these two....when 2 months are up they shoudl be hopefully ready to be bred if they gain any weight and are healthy. Literally both their eyes are barely light pink! Poor things....so I should probably dry them up hugh?
     
  2. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

    16,497
    4
    0
    It's tough to even get me to agree that horsepastes are correct, let alone someone with 400 milkers :)

    Ivermectin, you can heed about a 48 hour milk withdrawal for drinking the milk, but you can still feed it to goatlings or other animals...and alot of folks heed no milkwithdrawal because it is a human wormer.

    Ok on that subject think I will start a thread for someone to look up that statement and find us some proof, and perhaps even the worms it kills in humans?

    All anyone can tell you is what they know form having animals on their farm.

    I was shocked she didn't tell you to fecal, surely someone with 400 goats fecals or they would go broke buying wormer by the case. Vicki
     

  3. mamatomany

    mamatomany New Member

    1,239
    0
    0
    She did say to fecal them when the 3 weeks are done...I have already been through the round of quest and valbazen, and the pelleted type by durvet and the whites of their eyes are pretty near just that, white. I did the subq version of ivermectin if that makes any difference (cheaper than the sheep pour on). I'm not sure how she manages, but she suggested for my crazy girls to blast them with ivermectin and then check. They obviously have something eatin all this food I'm given them...
     
  4. BlissBerry

    BlissBerry Guest

    Have you treated these does for cocci?

    Sara
     
  5. Sondra

    Sondra New Member

    9,442
    1
    0
    OK first off once your does are so anemic that their eyes are pretty near white, even worming and worming and worming is NOT going to help the color of their eyes.
    YOU have to build back up their systems with good nutrition so they are no longer anemic. Get some red cell and give to help with this. IN MY OPINION don't give any more wormers until you do fecal checks but I would treat for cocci
     
  6. LMonty

    LMonty New Member

    442
    0
    0
    yea, ivermectin is used in humans in tropical countries, i've done research on that in the past.

    heres something on it from Wikipedia, while I dont necessarily consider that source as totally reliable, I do find it a good, easy to read starting point for further research if I need to do it :

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivermectin

    Humans
    Ivermectin is a broad-spectrum antiparasitic agent. It is mainly used in humans in the treatment of onchocerciasis, but is also effective against other worm infestations (such as strongyloidiasis, ascariasis, trichuriasis and enterobiasis). More recent evidence supports its off-label use in the treatment of mites such as scabies, usually limited to cases that prove resistant to topical treatments and/or who present in advanced state (such as Norwegian scabies).

    Therapeutic dosage

    Adults
    Oral: 3 to 12 mg as a single dose per os (about 150 to 200 µg/kg bodyweight) for onchocerciasis and other parasitic infections. (Ex. 45 kg would be about 6.75 mg to 9 mg)
    Children
    Ivermectin is not given to children weighing less than 15 kg. The dose is 150 µg/kg bodyweight (in children weighing more).
    Contraindications
    Ivermectin is contraindicated in persons with an immediate hypersensitivity to the drug. It should not be given to mothers who are breast-feeding until the infant is at least three months old (Reynolds, 1993).


    I am also a bit concerned about the possbility of the Quest not being as consistent, although I have no idea where that idea got started and if its really true. I just dilute mine with water- sqeeze out the whole tube and add 3 times the volume of water to it. I dont recall the volume offhand, its on the label. Then I mix well and have a clear liquid that is the same strength as the cattle med, and I can use those dosage amounts without adjustment. Its my supposition that as long as I mix/shake it well before each use, the chance of it being erraticly depositied in the gel is gone since the gel has dissolved and it should be evely distributed through the solution.
     
  7. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

    16,497
    4
    0
    ......................

    Have you spent some time reading the forum? You might want to.

    "I have already been through the round of quest and valbazen, and the pelleted type by durvet and the whites of their eyes are pretty near just that, white."

    If you continue like this you will have no wormers left to use in 3 years. Their whites of their eyes are white because you have blood sucking worms. Ivermectin is pretty worthless for HC/Barber Pole blood sucking worms. Plus you injected it rather than giving it orally when you give all wormers to goats orally, so in reality once again you only used your Ivermectin for lice, mites and nosebots. So even though you used all these wormers, the only wormer that could have worked was the Quest. Now in my area I know folks who have used quest and got poor results on fecal with it, then paid the big bucks for Cydectin and had it work, so the only conclusion I could come up with was the small single dosed pastes like this aren't evenly mixed with drugs...or the goat spit it out after they left :) The whole spitting it out thing is why after TBZ in the olden days, worming our dinasaurs, I hate pastes and refuse to use them.

    Ivermectin does work well still on cool weather worms that do eat condition of your does. So if you have skinny does, and you tape wormed them with the Valbazen lets talk what you are feeding them once you get that fecal done.

    This is why, look at the money you have spent...it is cheaper to get a fecal sample....have the vet tell you what worms you have...tell us here, because if a dog and cat vet you will get all sorts of weird, hookworms or round worms :) Then we could help you find a wormer we know works for that worm.

    You need to fecal now before you give any more worm meds, the whites of their eyes like Sondra said will take weeks to pink up, you have to do things now to build blood volume. Don't even think about breeding anyone until they have pink mucous membranes. Vicki