question about medicated feed

Discussion in 'Dairy Goat Info' started by pokyone42, Nov 19, 2008.

  1. pokyone42

    pokyone42 New Member

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    Okay.. In early September, (the 4th..) we picked up an hours old buck kid.... a litle Boer-baby, who we called "Little Joe", (who DID have plenty of colostrum, just in case you are wondering........) Granted, it was a 95 degree ride home in my lap, but he is a trooper, and he did just fine, and during that ride, I happened to fall in love with our new little tiny baby 10 pound future herd-sire......:)

    Anyway, in the past, I have always done the Sulmet in a bottle for cocci prevention, and we always have fed our kids either coarse 14 or caprine challenger.. made by the Blue Seal company.,, along with alfalfa pellets....

    This has always worked very well for us. No problems. Our kids grow well, and produce nicely as yearlings. ( I am just trying to give as much info. as needed...)

    (This kid,Joey, however, needed extra Bo-Se and Vitamin E, as he got a bit weak in the back end, his first two weeks....Soon, he did just fine....thanks to YOU folks....)


    Well,, when we got little baby Joe, he was separated from all of our other goats right from the start, as he was about 5 months younger, and a BIG target for growing kids trying to find their place in a herd of hann-yaulks, and so they did their best to try and beat him up..........

    (little did they know that they would have ME to contend with...lol) we did NOT want him beaten up, or hurt badly, and so right from the start, we separated him, or, I acted like a VERY protective mama-goat. We kept/keep him in a very clean kidding pen...much to his chagrin.

    He is now, about 10 weeks old, and getting a bottle in the morning..free choice hay, grain, and alfalfa pellets. We have had him on the Blue Seal medicated Meat Goat Pellets since he has been growing wonderfully, and he seems to be very strong and healthy.

    He began nibbliing at grain, at a few weeks old......the medicated pellets......... (We have NEVER used these pellets before.) The medication in the pellets is "Decoquinate" a coccidiostat.... we were told by another Boer breeder that they are great for meat goats.........tho this medicated feed is a new thing for us....we decided to try it.....all seemed good for a while with little Joe........

    We DO let this kid interact with the other goats when we are supervising.......(which includes: older kids asserting their authority, and butting him a bit. He thinks he is a 200 pound buck, however, our baby does tell him and us otherwise... He is usually in with the herd only for about 15 minutes a day.........) We treated this kid as we treat all of our kids with Valbezan at 3 weeks, and again a bit later. All of the other kids are growing well and doing GREAT!

    This kid now, (Joe...) at ten weeks old, is suddenly producing very clumpy stool, as of a few days ago......which is VERY odiferous.............. He seems fine, and we have not done the Sulmet, yet.. I was hoping that the medicated pellets were enough. I am thinking that I might be wrong here. And so, if I DO indeed need to use Sulmet on this kid, will I be overdosing him if I continue with the meat goat med. pellets, and Sulmet at the same time??
    Thank you in advance
     
  2. shawhee

    shawhee Member

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    Sally,
    Im still relatively new here, but I believe that Vicki or Kaye have said that there is not enough medication (that the young kids can never eat enough of it) to control cocci in kids. I have my 6 mo old buckling on medicated pellets and I still do corid treatment every 21 days.

    Shawna
     

  3. Theresa

    Theresa New Member

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    Shawna is right. Read on the bag of feed and it will tell you how much the kid has to eat for the medication to be at a theraputic level. Usually at 10 weeks kids are not eatting enough, so you need to go ahead and treat him for cocci. If you can get a fecal that would be great to make sure that he does not have any other worms. Even if he is with the herd for only a short time, he can eat grass or whatever that has worms or eggs. Treat now before you have a problem.
    Theresa
     
  4. Sondra

    Sondra New Member

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    Yep you have to do regular cocci meds with kids don't rely on medicated feed.
     
  5. pokyone42

    pokyone42 New Member

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    Thanks folks. Will start him on Sulmet in the morning. :)
     
  6. stoneyheightsfarm

    stoneyheightsfarm New Member

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    Kaye and Vicki have said that legally, they can't put enough of the medication in the feed for it to do what it needs to do in goats. The feed labels give dosage amounts that might work in cattle, but not goats. So still, you need more than what the label says and even my 9 month old does can't eat that much! All recommendations I've got here have been to use both the medicated grain and the Corid or Sulfa. I just started doing that this month with my boys, and finally they are keeping clean fecals! I've also switched to a pelleted rumensin feed instead of decoxx, but I don't like the other ingredients and the goats don't like the taste as well. For all the hassle (have to special order it every time I need some), I might go back to the decoxx feed if I'm just going to give corid every 3 weeks anyway, too.
     
  7. pokyone42

    pokyone42 New Member

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    okay.. I am treating him now with the Sulmet, and his poos have already improved.

    This is probably a stupid question, but... It is a medicated goat pellet..not a calf pellet or any other species...(and YES! I bought it thinking that I would not have to use additional meds or preventative measures.) Is it medicated a little, just so that folks will THINK it has what they need, and so buy it, like I did? If it does NOT have enough medication to be effective, than why is it sold in the first place, (other than to sell to unsuspecting goat owners like me?) Just wondering... thanks.
     
  8. Theresa

    Theresa New Member

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    I think that it works in older kids at least to keep the numbers down. But I don't think that your little guy is eatting enough at this point to be effective. That is what you have to keep in mind. Unless he is eatting a pound or whatever the amount on the bag says, then he is not even getting close to the dose of medication that he needs.
    Theresa
     
  9. stoneyheightsfarm

    stoneyheightsfarm New Member

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    I think it has enough for sheep, too... Not that you would feed your sheep a goat feed, but I think that's where the dosage came from??? I know I've read that Vicki free choices her medicated grain to the kids so that they can get more, but I think her mineral program is so spot-on that it makes a huge difference as well. Seems a lot of the study in "small ruminants" focused on sheep more than goats, so that might explain some of the problem. Others would know far better than I would on that one.

    I have 2 goats that the medicated pellet is all they need. Then 3 more that require additional medication, and one of those only recently. The two it works for are my older ones, but they've never had issues, even when younger and not on medicated feed. They still don't eat what the feed label says they should to get enough medicine (according to the feed label). Says they should be getting a pound per 30 pounds of weight. At that rate, they should be eating over 3 pounds a day, and they only eat 2.3 pounds a day.
     
  10. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

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    First they have to full fed on it, free choice, and you have to start when cocci numbers are non exsistant, or you have treated while they are on it. The med levels are for sheepandgoats they are not for the mg/kg goats need for treatment. So adding this or that to the diet, decreases the amount your goat eats and then you have outbreaks. Biggy is to learn to fecal, pop for a chambered slide, or take a chambered slide and give it to your vet who does your fecals. Have eggs identified and counted, it's the only way you know anything at all. If you can purchase your feeds from coops ask them about rumensin and what the mg/kg they use of it in the feed, I know ours in bryan is correct if you don't have anything against feeding fish and feather meal and bakery products :) :)

    Like we do with corid you have to find the correct mg/kg for treatment in goat medicine, than have someone use it who fecals and can tell you it works. I know for myself with the new corid dosages given 7 times 21 days apart, with the kids on only the meatgoat pellet I feed with only alfalfa hay and some grass hay and what they can eat off their tiny place now (which I pitched a fit about when son stacked out his place to build his house) but I really do think coupled with the dosages of corid, my religous zeal over dosages given on time, I didn't have enough cocci to even count on one slide, through weaning either. I did not continue using corid after weaning, I used the meat goat pellets. Drug is deccoqinate in them. But.....I also used lasalocid for YEARS, so I would doubt I have the resistance to deccoquinate others are seeing. Vicki