My buck is really worrying me.

Discussion in 'Dairy Goat Info' started by Cotton Eyed Does, Oct 24, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Cotton Eyed Does

    Cotton Eyed Does New Member

    1,918
    1
    0
    He won't eat. He has breeding so heavily on his mind that he is not eating any of his feed........nothing. I put fresh food out for him every day. I've tried a mixture of alfalfa pellets and his feed, I've even bought some sweet feed to mix in with it to entice him to eat and he will not eat. He isn't eating his hay and is also drinking very very little water. He is skin and bones. All he does is walk the fence. DH said I should put him up front with the 2 bred boer does that are in a separate pen. Think that might help?
     
  2. Sondra

    Sondra New Member

    9,442
    1
    0
    possibly but depends on how far along the does are I would think as he could get rough.
    give him some salt on his tongue so he will at least drink. By my bucks look like death warmed over too, except for the MM who won't miss a meal of any kind.:)
     

  3. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

    16,497
    4
    0
    As long as he is ruminating it's all you can do. Switching feed, and horrors! giving him sweet feed, a huge switch, especially since it doesn't have ammonium chloride in it, could do the opposite of what you want.

    GE is the most laid back buck I have, he doesn't pee all over himself, a good brushing and I could show him tommorrow. He doesn't run the girls...why use up the calories if they aren't in heat, he doesn't fight and he doesn't pace. Now Nic...OMG, Mr. young testosterone, he is skinny, so long bodied he now looks like a slinky toy :) his beautiful white highlights are now yellow and bred or not he wants the girls. Every buck is different...but yes I do think giving him his own girls if he is not mean to them, keeps wieght on your bucks who do stress like this during rut, I am not a fan of bucks alone though and mine will be pared with the girls they bred after milking Dec 1st is over for, milk for sale. Vicki
     
  4. Cotton Eyed Does

    Cotton Eyed Does New Member

    1,918
    1
    0
    I've been giving him A.C. and probiotics and a shot of Vitamin B Complex. Just been trying to mix a little something in to entice him to eat. My last doe is suppose to come back into heat on Sunday. As soon as I find out if her A.I. took, I'll move him up front with the 2 bred boer does. It is a large paddock from the driveway all the way down to the road and over to the woods. Maybe that will make the little horn dog happy. :rofl
     
  5. haeema

    haeema New Member

    160
    0
    0
    I put my girls in a holding pen in the morning before milking. I feed Beau Ty behind the shelter where he can't see them. I know he knows they are there but he seems to eat better. I also keep all the milkers up so that he has time to eat. He is such a gentleman that he will let the girls have his feed. Of course, it's just a ploy so that he can check them to see if they may need "attention." ;) ;)
     
  6. Cotton Eyed Does

    Cotton Eyed Does New Member

    1,918
    1
    0
    This morning he was worse. Standing in his shed, weak and had diarrhea. He has been dewormed and vaccinated and all the normal things you do before breeding season and was dewormed again a couple weeks ago with Ivomec. He still won't eat so I took some of his food and water and Probios and mixed it up to a thin gruel in my food processor and syringe fed him twice today. I let him have 2 of the girls that he has bred in with him in his pasture. He followed them around this morning for a while and then said.... ah to heck with it and went off by himself. He is laying by himself now, still won't eat a bite and I don't think he is ruminating, no cudding. I gave him more probios, more Vitamin B Complex this morning also. I may have waited too long. He does not look good. I syringed water in him today and I did see him drink from the tub, but not much. I will warm some fluids tomorrow and sub q them when I treat him in the morning........if he makes it. This is unreal. He has gone from a vigorous eater, excited, happy active buck 3-4 weeks ago to this skin and bones bag of weak nothing today. Glad I've got 30 straws in the tank.
     
  7. SandyReuel

    SandyReuel New Member

    18
    0
    0
    Have you taken his temp? It sounds to me like he has something else going on with him and is sick. check his temp and go from there.
    Sandy
     
  8. Cotton Eyed Does

    Cotton Eyed Does New Member

    1,918
    1
    0
    Oh Fecal he has no worms to speak of, but the cocci level is elevated (He is 1 1/2 years old, but in his stressed breeding condition... maybe they blossomed) so I started corid treatment on him yesterday. His temp was 100.9 this morning. I warmed his gruel and syringe fed him about 2 cups of it. More probios, corid (recommended treatment dosages on here), A.C. with some water. Also another 5 ccs of Vitamin B Complex. He had more strength this morning and kept walking off with me straddling him. He was a handful for one person to treat this morning. I was surprised actually. I really wasn't sure if he would even be alive this morning. I don't have any Keifer was wondering if some buttermilk might help his rumen? If so about how much. I don't have any yogurt, but I could go pick up some. I have the blue paste probiotic and I have some powdered.
     
  9. Sondra

    Sondra New Member

    9,442
    1
    0
    Would use your probiotics would make a gruel of beet pulp (I take it boil in microwave with water then run thru the blender) add more water if needed to feed him and lactated ringers syringing water is not going to be enough. you have to get that temp up.
     
  10. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

    16,497
    4
    0
    What color are his eye membranes? I have no idea if you can even use Ivermectin, I know I can't it does nothing here. Being just 20 minutes away I can't believe your not going to have similar problems like mine. Also I see few if any eggs on fecal, so looking at eyelids becomes important this time of year, especially with the immunity does carry while pregnant, fewer eggs on fecal in our heavily working bucks (and even if he has only bred a few goats he is acting like he is used heavily). Just because we don't see eggs on fecal does not mean adult worms are not sucking his blood. I bet he is severely anemic, it's why he has no energy to eat or to walk around, why now his rumen is shutting down and not keeping him warm.

    Warm him up with subq lactated ringers warmed to 103, jacket him. B vitamins, unless your 5cc was from fortified B complex it did nothing to give him 5cc from plain ole B complex, and even then 5cc in a buck isn't even enough of forteified. With him in rut I would also steal cud, IV fluids immediatly that are warmed, and bed him in the barn. Have Merry out to run blood on him and see what you can do to get his blood volume up...iron etc. Back before we had a good handle on our cocci and worm problems we used to keep wethers around to donate blood. Bucks are pretty bomb proof, and if this turns out to be blood volume that has brought on this decline, you really need to look into your minerals, bolusing if your boys like mine don't consume minerals, use this liver if he dies as a base line of what is going on in your herd, and also looking for adult worms and cocci damage. You shouldn't be still having these ongoing problems in your herd, something is amiss, and it usually is something very basic that is overlooked. Vicki
     
  11. Cotton Eyed Does

    Cotton Eyed Does New Member

    1,918
    1
    0
    I tried to answer your questions inside the quote box above.
    Thanks for all the suggestions. We'll see how it goes. Actually, if he is going to be this hard to keep during rutting season I'm better off with him in the tank than in my pasture.

    UPdated: He is worse today. Still doing meds, fluids, all the above.
     
  12. Oregonian Chick

    Oregonian Chick New Member

    91
    0
    0
    I can't help much because you are doing what I would already be doing but I can offer my sympathy! My oldest buck Toy is horrible during breeding season (though thankfully this year he is just lean not mister bones). He never has been much of a big food guy anyways but when breeding season hits hooboy. Last year he wore himself down to skin and bones from not eating. So I feel your pain! It does to me sound like something is going on though. I had something like what is happening to your buck right now happen this summer except for me I lost 1 buck to that. It hit fast and it hit HARD (within three days I had one dead buck and one very sickly buck). I still to this day have no clue what happened except that what ever it was was NASTY and thank the lord it didn't hit the does.

    I am sorry you are fighting this with him :(. Does your feed store sell beet pulp? I have used beet pulp with my buck Toy to help him keep some weight on during rut. I get the pelleted kind then make a mash out of it by putting a small amount of the pellets in a bucket and pouring hot water over it and adding a bit of molasses to sweeten it. He is a picky eater but he would eat that when I gave it to him. Good luck with your boy Chris! I hope he pulls through!

    Justine
     
  13. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

    16,497
    4
    0
    He was dewormed twice (August and September) with Cydectin and Valbazen and I hit him with Ivomec the other day just to try a different wormer for something that the other wormers might not have killed.
    ..........

    I think if you went back and read your posts you would find this is a common thread with how you deal with your herd. Meds and 3 or 4 different wormers and then a bad outcome. It's a vicious cycle you could instantly stop if you knew what worms you have, what kills them. I wormed in March after kidding which includes the bucks, I wormed the weekend after the hurricane. (Other than Ginger who is new who has gotten more wormings).


    The anemia is not caused by him not eating.

    When we put the amounts of meds we have to put into our goats it has to be because they need it and it works, when they don't need it, it taxes the liver. Then any stress at all, destroys the liver and the goat dies. We can't treat a disease or parasite infection and then have a sick goat in 4 weeks and not see that either the adult worms were not killed or evacuated so they are back sucking blood, or the damage to the liver is now showing with what is not a relapse of the original cause but of liver failure.

    It's harder I think for those who have had goats long ago, to now 15 years later to wrap their mind around the new way of thinking about our goats.

    I know Ric had more problems with his alpines than ever with his nubians, and I know Ginger has a higher level of worm eggs than anyone else here, but she is also milking more than all but one of my does and just recently stressed with the move here. She had incredibly large numbers of HC after the hurricane. Vicki
     
  14. Liberty Alpines

    Liberty Alpines New Member

    142
    0
    0
    How is he doing today Christine?
    Kristin
     
  15. Cotton Eyed Does

    Cotton Eyed Does New Member

    1,918
    1
    0
    He's not doing well. I really don't expect him to make it.
     
  16. KJFarm

    KJFarm Senior Member

    1,197
    1
    0
    Chris, several years back, I lost 2 nice does to a worm overload (I was rotating wormers). This was before I knew about Cydectin being used in goats. One of my favorite does was following the path of the ones I had lost, and she was literally dying before my eyes. Eating and drinking nothing, and was so weak that if anything bumped her, she would fall. A friend told me about the Cydectin and I decided that I had nothing to lose by giving it to her. I'm telling you, within a day, she turned around and by 3 days, she had an appetite. Took her a long time to build back up, but she never had another sick day in her life - but she was one that I had to worm more frequently. She lived to be 12 years old, we put her down this year, because she had gotten a shoulder injury and was in much pain. Sure hope you can pull this buck through.
     
  17. Bella Star

    Bella Star New Member

    1,273
    1
    0
    Sure sounds like worms to me, I would give him some red cell iron and worm him with cydectin, if he makes it ,I (think) I would give him some Milkthistle pills to help rejuvenate his liver as liver can be repaired somewhat.
    Did your other buck do this way and did he have the same symptoms ?
     
  18. Cotton Eyed Does

    Cotton Eyed Does New Member

    1,918
    1
    0
    He passed away. Thanks for the replies and suggestions.
     
  19. BlissBerry

    BlissBerry Guest

    Chris,

    What did the necropsy show?

    Sara
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.