Help doe with labored breathing.-spiked fever.-lost doe

Discussion in 'Dairy Goat Info' started by MayLOC, Feb 15, 2008.

  1. MayLOC

    MayLOC New Member

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    doe is 11 month old and 6 weeks from kidding. She and two other yearlings get 6 pounds a. pellets and 1 1/2 pounds cob and some grass/alfalfa hay split between them /day.

    last thursday evening doe seemed a bit off; had flu bad and didn't deal with her then :sigh.

    friday morning she still seemed off. most noticable symptom was labored fast breathing. took temp and was 103.9 no cough, no snot no rattle in breath. started her on nuflor 5 days.

    friday night temp was 104.3. gave banamine.

    sat. morning temp. 104.7 gave banamine

    sun. temp just under 104. more banamine

    mon. temp back to normal. still labored/fast breathing.

    temp has been normal the rest of the week but breathing hasn't improved. She continued to eat fairly well through the week, but not with her usual vigor. still not up to par. She also drank well through the week -i give them warm water twice a day so I watch them drink)

    gave her vit.b. complex and rewormed her beg. of week also.

    what do you think? Is she looking at permanent lung damage?? I know the labored breathing didn't start earlier than last thursday as I always study these girls during chore time. anything else I can do for her?

    I did give her a little more banamine yesterday and today as she was grinding her teeth quite a bit. so the last two temps were on banamine. they were around 101.4 ea.

    ideas?
     
  2. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    Is she better after the worming? You might want to worm with Ivermectin Plus and also a white wormer for tapes. Thinking lungworms, liverflukes or perhaps tapes in enough numbers. Is she anemic? This can bring on congestive heart failure. Scar tissue from pnemonia is almost always wheezing after running, not asthma type symptoms. Asthma type symptoms can be brought on from enclosed barns. The old standby of kneeling down in your goat pen and get your nose down to the heighth of theirs, are your knees wet, does it smell of ammonia? This can bring on chemical pnemonia, not a lot of symptoms except scarred lungs and wheezing. Lime, DE and other chemicals can do this also.

    Most of this is just something for you to think on, the only questions are what did you worm with, did you fecal and is she showing anemia. vicki
     

  3. SherrieC

    SherrieC Active Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    On a different track,
    was it more Warm out than usual? It's Possible with her heavy bred and just a little girl that she's having trouble finding Room to breathe, and maybe she was jumping around playing and got overheated. I've had ff do just that before & worried me silly.
     
  4. MayLOC

    MayLOC New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    I think this gal is definitely off. Last week she was perky. She is no longer her usual self. She lays around a bit more than she was, she walks slowly, doesn't eat with vigor, isn't always chewing her cud anymore. definitely off and doesn't appear to feel real well.

    I have checked for anemia and she looks fine. compared her to all the others. Wormed with ivomec. did not fecal.

    barn/shed is airy. ground inside is dry. no chemicals used on ground.

    forgot to say that two days ago I heard her cough a pretty wet congested cough. I had never heard a cough prior and she has not really been coughing since.

    I am the one who lost the yearling doe to pneumonia a month back. I had four doe kids bred at this lady's place and brought them home and the one was sick when I brought her home. two others were sick w/in a week and instantly treated with nuflor and got better. this one doe never got sick. they are all 4 together--well now three- and in a pen by themselves. One of the other bred doe kids in this pen did have a nasty cough a week ago with a little runny nose that she is getting over by herself. then this one with the heavy breathing started up right after her. All my other does/kids have been fine w/no sniffles or anything but they are not in contact with this group.

    side note;;;the breeder I had the 4 kids getting bred at told me recently that after I picked mine up she had another get sick and then her neighbor-who I think was breeding with her also- lost 5 does to a respiratory thing.
     
  5. Sondra

    Sondra New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    OK have never used Nuflor so don't know how it is supposed to be used or for how long. You need to keep up the antibiotics long enough to get rid of everything. VIT C and more vit c /B Complex everyday your giving antibiotics and probios every day or twice a day. I also give an antihistamine
     
  6. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    Double check your drug amounts and route via Kaye...after a course of Nuflor and banamine she should be better...why I was thinking worms. vicki
     
  7. MayLOC

    MayLOC New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.--worse

    well doe is worse today :down

    Her temp is 101.3

    She is not eating. she is not cudding. I cut all grain several days ago. giving a. pellets and a very good alfalfa hay free choice to her now.

    Her front legs are a little trembly and are bothering her. she keeps shifting weight between the two and acts as though walking is painful. There is no trembling in her back legs or muscles. Her feet are in good shape and are not hot. Ears are droopy this morning.

    Her breathing is about 3x as fast as any of the others. Not panting, but breathing very fast.

    I already did the 5 days nuflor, so I stopped there. I used the advice from kaye from her previous posts on my other pneumonia doe, so I think they were sufficient.

    I also gave her bo-se, probiotics, more vit. b complex and today I gave her 30 cc MFO

    I really don't want to loose this girl as this is the 2nd. of the two I bought from this breeder and had bred to her buck. :sigh But I am at a loss!
     
  8. MayLOC

    MayLOC New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    forgot to say...

    No, she didn't improve any after the worming that I could tell. I think? tapes are usually visable in the poop and if that is right I have not seen any in hers. she has been very healthy up until this. good thick shiny coat, no cough ever, frisky and ornery with the other two in her pen.
     
  9. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    The difference is that these goats were moved. No stress in living at home your whole life, move them and previous problems come to light in the new farm. Have you tested these for CAE? Yourself? If you loose this doe I would test her, your recourse for money back will depend on this. Does who are positive at home, once moved will stress, the virus becomes active, and with the stress of the weather, both the interstesial form of CAE (like HIV has pnemocystic pnemonia) goats autoimmune disease has it's penmonia also, and it is rarely effect with drugs.

    With her now not cudding she is either dieing with her organs shutting down...or you have been looking at some sort of toxin from the get go. Once she is dead at least cut her open to look at her lungs, you can see pnemonia on both bottom lobes of her lungs. I would also pull blood now and put it away for testing.

    Pnemonia that doesn't kill them during the fever stage is rarely just pasteurella. I would also test her for mycoplasma. vicki
     
  10. MayLOC

    MayLOC New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    these girls were raised on CAE prevention, tested neg. prior to purchase and I just retested them and they were all neg. again. I also bought a then yearling milker from the same place and she also tested cae neg. I kept her home and bred her to my nubian however, so she wasn't near as stressed.

    ya, I knew they had been exposed to a lot more stress and have been babying them more than any of my others. I actually bought these two girls back in July brought them home and took them back for breeding for a few weeks in Nov. then brought them back again. so a lot of stress on them for sure.

    Had thoughts about mycoplasma also.

    just don't know what more to do right now for the gal and discouraged.

    thanks for the help.

    any thoughts on the soreness in the front end??
     
  11. Sondra

    Sondra New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    Where did you give the shots?? front end??
     
  12. Sunny Daze

    Sunny Daze New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    not sure about with goats but i know high fever can lead to lamanitis/founder in horses (which would make front feet sensitive). Doesn't sound like her fever was ever that incredibly high though...
     
  13. MayLOC

    MayLOC New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    yes, sondra, about half of the shots have gone over the ribs and the rest in her neck area. there is a swelling this morning in her neck area from one of the shots that I thought maybe was causing/contributing to the pain in the front end. forgot to say that much. thanks.
     
  14. goatkid

    goatkid New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.

    I'm trying to brainstorm on this one. It's been a while since she was at the breeder's place and you say she was otherwise healthy until this, so unless it's some chronic illness such as mycoplasma, I'd be surprised if it was something she picked up there. Some of us did have a few of our goats pick up swine pneumonia at a goat show and at least three of us lost a young goat to it. The goats showed symptoms right away, and I lost mine a week later. She didn't have that rapid breathing, though. She had snots, a cough and fever. One of my friends had a goat who had a cough and labored breathing. The doeling didn't respond to Nuflor, so she was taken to the vet who performed an Xray. It turned out that the goat had only one functional lung due to a congenital defect, and this caused her heart to become enlarged. The doe was put down. With vet records, she was able to get the goat replaced. I'd get your doe into the vet. It almost sounds like congestive heart failure.
    Kathie
     
  15. MayLOC

    MayLOC New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.-spiked fever.

    Well this afternoon she started panting. temp was 104.7 came inside for more banamine. gave her the shot and took the temp again and now at 105.9 :down

    gave her some excenel. doesn't look good now.

    thanks for your thoughts Kathie. No I agree this wasn't some simple thing she picked up at the breeders. that has been since the beg. of dec. but i was wondering if it might be mycoplasma that has been causing problems with this group of kids. bought 2 from this breeder and 2 from her neighbor (that were from her stock also) and they were all 4 were at the breeder's for nov. got home and the one was sick on pickup date and eventually lost her. also treated the other two with nuflor in dec. so, not sure if it is something, or if they are just stressed and immune systems are all shot. anyhow...I am where I am now and not sure what to do different. the breeder has been very honerable and paid meds fees on the first sick one and has offered to replace her.

    Just wish I could help this gal now.
     
  16. goatkid

    goatkid New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.-spiked fever.

    Hopefully, the Excenel will do the trick. I remember one year that my friend had two does come down with pneumonia right after kidding. They didn't respond and she lost one doe. It just so happened that her partner's cattle had pneumonia at the same time and weren't responding to Nuflor, but did respond to Naxel. She gave the doe Naxel and it saved her life. I hope you can save your girl. Has your vet seen her?
     
  17. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.-spiked fever.

    I would also think about a change of drugs. I am a huge fan of Naxcel. I know Excenell is supposed to be the same thing with a shelf life, but I have not seen this. Have you called or emailed Kaye? There are other antibiotics we dont' talk about openly on forum that work really well in goats, especially when all else has failed. vicki
     
  18. MayLOC

    MayLOC New Member

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    Re: Help doe with labored breathing.-spiked fever.

    well darn I lost the girl a few hours ago. :sigh :sigh

    with the other pneumonia doe I had last 2 months back Kaye had suggested naxcel or excenel as a 2nd. course of treatment, so I was following the same protocol. I had not heard of debate of naxcel vs. excenel, so no I didn't know.

    Last week when I started her on nuflor, I thought if anything I was jumping the gun. Like I said I have been extra precautious with these girls, as I knew they had been through a lot of stress the past several months. She just didn't appear that sick. Not a high fever, still eating fine at that time, cudding and acting pretty normal. Her breathing was only slightly off and I had to watch her very closely to even be able to tell at that time. I really thought I was jumping the gun by starting her on the nuflor, but wanted to be safe.

    I am just so dissapointed. Dissapointed in the outcome and dissapointed in myself. crap happens, I know that all too well having been in cattle all my life. but with the goats we have such smaller numbers that there really is no cushion.

    thanks again for the help though. I would feel really lost without this forum for feedback and help.
     
  19. goatkid

    goatkid New Member

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    I'm so sorry you lost her. It sounds like you did all you could. This happens to us all occasionally.
    Kathie
     
  20. Sunny Daze

    Sunny Daze New Member

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    So sorry to hear that, you certainly tried though :(