Crossbreeding

Discussion in 'Dairy Goat Info' started by Asian Goats, Feb 18, 2009.

  1. Asian Goats

    Asian Goats New Member

    52
    0
    0
    Would like to talk to anyone who has crossbred the nubian with either the saanen or alpine or both
    -difference between milk yields and lactation over pb nubians
    -not able so far to get nubians to lactate past 150-180 days on average,need 300-305 days for viable commercial dairy operation
    -the move is to breed snubians but maybe necessary to breed in the alpine also then back to nubian
    -saanen and alpine on their own do poorly in the tropical heat
    -no nubian so far has made the 305 day period on any farm in country,few saanens have made the 305 days but low milk yields,no info on the alpines

    any info will be helpful:
    Michael
     
  2. shawhee

    shawhee Member

    422
    1
    18
    Just wondering why not LaMancha?
     

  3. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

    16,497
    1
    0
    Just wanted to thank you for posting, I love your story! Hoping Tracy will note this post she has a snubian line.

    Not the breeds you are doing, but when I dairied the backbone of our dairy was LaMancha crosses, crosed with anything we simply had hybrid vigor, more milk on less grain...but like all hybrids, it was the first cross that was spectacular. Vicki
     
  4. goatkid

    goatkid New Member

    2,730
    0
    0
    I have one Snubian. She makes lots of milk her first three to four months fresh, but drops fronm there. Some of my purebred Nubians have longer lactations. The doe I had with the longest lactation and also lots of milk was a La Mancha Nubian cross. Kathie
     
  5. Sondra

    Sondra New Member

    9,442
    0
    0
    Those LaMancha's just have the will to keep on milking. Don't know if you have them tho where your at.
     
  6. Theresa

    Theresa New Member

    983
    0
    0
    I agree with Vicki on the nubian/lamancha crosses. One of the first goats that I ever had was a nubian/lamancha cross and she out milked any other goat that I had, on less grain, and even in our Texas heat. She was just wonderful. And had great milk too.
    Theresa
     
  7. Tracy in Idaho

    Tracy in Idaho Member

    829
    0
    16
    I absolutely *loved* my Snubian. She went Top Ten the one year I had her on test --
    292-3250-116-102
    Now to be perfectly honest -- that's nothing compared to my Alpine numbers, but it's pretty good :)

    I crossed her Alpine, and her daughters were some of the biggest and milkiest does I ever had. I wish now that I had kept them (and would have had I known she would die at only 7 yrs)

    Have no idea how they'd perform in the tropics though - we have almost 0% humidity and I live at almost 5500' in elevation. I do know the summers here (which can occasionally get to 100 F) never seemed to bother them much.

    Tracy
     
  8. homeacremom

    homeacremom New Member

    743
    0
    0
    Are there management changes that might help improve the lactation curves and yields in addition to refining the genetics?
    I ask because the same genetics can milk very differently under different styles of management.
     
  9. Haglerfarm

    Haglerfarm New Member

    216
    0
    0
    I have a friend who has spectacular recorded grades (Nubian/LaMancha). These goats really milk. They are beautiful besides that.
    I know she milks several on long lactations for her milk customers in the winter months.
    We are in Tennessee and they take the humid heat very well. May be an idea for you to try if possible.
    Les
     
  10. Asian Goats

    Asian Goats New Member

    52
    0
    0
    Ladies you are a wealth of information,thanks.
    The climate in country,well if one went into their bathroom and turned the hot water on in their shower and stood their for some time,that sums it up or the hottest days in Hawaii,100F that would be in the shade.I have noticed the LaMancha breed spoken of before but not many people believe it will handle the climate and due to its small ears people will shy away from this breed.Myself and some others believe the snubian is a starting point but might need the alpine bred in to help with development.I was advised to breed at the f2 level, half brothers to half sisters and we are considering then breeding in a alpine then back to the nubian to help the girls handle the climate.The nubians are so far the best choice for the climate but they seem to all have short laction periods.I totally agree ladies that management plays a very important part here,those of us who are looked upon as outsiders in country provide our stocks with the level of care almost equal to N.America.Our girls are dewormed on a regular schedule,receive monthly injections of vitamin c for their immune systems and b12 for appetite,small amounts of backing soda with their concentrates to help prevent bloat and vinegar in their drinkling water.They also require more salt than goats here.Kelp is free for the taking as it is a export product and can be found on the shoreline for the taking and dried then powered.Commercial concentrates is the standard but very very very expensive.Forage grasses and certain tree leaves also standard.Housing is very different from here as the goats do very poorly on cement or dirt and must be elevated on plastic flooring,feet problems due to the rain,and believe me it does rain.Confinement is the standard but the goats do have a exercise area when the weather is nice and not too hot.We also have the same problem with finding vet(s) who understand goats,seems to be a problem all over,one must learn to do alot of the care themselves.The country is moving for a dairy industry and he/she who is able to produce the first quality milking goat(s) has the best shot at selling breeding stock and recouping their investment.Fully understand that this is not possible over night and will take many years of selection and culling but the future looks bright for those willing to take the gamble.
    Meat goats is another topic there.Maybe just maybe the wife and I have a shot in the dark with the snubian as our starting point.

    Thanks ladies:
    Michael & Edie
    Mustang Sally Agri Farm
     
  11. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

    16,497
    1
    0
    The US also went through at time where the only folks buying LaMancha's was other breeders. The ear stigma is pretty much gone, especially with the economy those wanting milkers want those who milk. And LaMancha's milk. When even the nubians are laying around under the shade trees and milking poorly (august here) the LaManchas milked rain or shine.

    I just don't see how going Saanen is going to be a good thing, considering you can't find even a handful of herds of them even as far south as I am, they simply do poorly in our heat. Vicki
     
  12. Asian Goats

    Asian Goats New Member

    52
    0
    0
    Miss Vicky
    I knew you had the answer.Interesting very few saanens down your way.Well,I would have to say at this point I now know something no one else in country knows.Good edge for us.The LaMancha,well,well.I will look into this breed and check if we can import frozen semen,will take some time to check out the possibilities and how many problems we face dealing with the PR Govt.From past dealings with this Govt. nothing comes easy.My wife and I will bypass on the saanen and alpine and continue with the nubian girls until we can work out the LaMancha issue.Ears do not bother us personally up or down or all around.
    I knew ladies you held the key,the early bird gets the worm first.
    Sincerely:
    Michael & Edie
    Mustang Sally Agri Farm
     
  13. Theresa

    Theresa New Member

    983
    0
    0
    Is it possible to import a buckling? Not sure how that all works but it might be worth looking into. Then you could just buy a really nice lamancha buckling and breed him to your nubian girls. Just thought I would through that out there.
    Theresa
     
  14. Asian Goats

    Asian Goats New Member

    52
    0
    0
    Miss Theresa
    it is possible,the million dollar question is,would we ever see the goat again once it landed on PR soil.At present know of one guy who imported some goats from the USA,passed cae testing on USA soil but failed cae testing on PR soil,goats have been in locked down for the last 2 years now, doubt if he will ever see those goats again.Was thinking maybe semen would be the better option.

    Wish to thank everyone for their input,its rather like damned if we do and damned if we don"t.

    Sincerely:
    Michael & Edi
     
  15. Terri-Lynn

    Terri-Lynn New Member

    137
    0
    0
    I am in Canada so heat isn't an issue here : ) but I've been told our local dairy has been successfull with a 3 way cross of Nubian, Sanaan and Alpine. I just thought it was interesting to breed for the 3 way cross.
     
  16. Bella Star

    Bella Star New Member

    1,273
    0
    0
    I love my LaMancha's ! They are the healthiest goats I have ,none of mine have ever been ill or had any antibiotics, less wormy and I have to dry my girls up as they just continue to produce milk right up to kidding. I have lived in hot humid Texas all my life and I have never ever saw a saanen , I have always thought of them as colder climate goats . I think there are 2 types of the LaManchas the larger and the shorter type ,mine are the large taller type.
    Thanks Vicki for your input on LaManchas.
     
  17. Douger

    Douger New Member

    30
    0
    0
    i have breed my billy to my alpine nanny but I'm at no help on production cause she was give 4 bucks and not a doe yet
     
  18. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

    16,497
    1
    0
    See if we had some form of NAIS our borders would open up with traceable disease protocoals :) Vicki
     
  19. Katarina

    Katarina New Member

    319
    0
    0
    I bet Lamanchas will do far better in the climate than any of the swiss breeds.
     
  20. Theresa

    Theresa New Member

    983
    0
    0
    I thought it might be a little difficult to get one shipped there. Well, then frozen semen is the next best thing!
    Theresa