I know this has been covered, and re-covered :sigh, but I forgot. :blush Anyway, I know that a doeling should be bred at a certain percentage of her mothers weight, that usually works out to around 80 pounds. What is that percentage?
Breeding weight
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I've never heard that one.??? :really I would be in trouble on some doelings, from does I've bought, that didn't have the same management as mine.
Kaye
Oh. ...So I should go by the roughly 80 pound rule? I have a 75 lb (weigh tape) Ober/Alpine doeling that I was hoping to breed end of Dec. She seems kind of short, but has a good stocky build and is quite muscular. She is 7.5 months old. The only thing I have to compare her to is a 160 lb, tall Nubian doe. My little one looks like a shrimp next to that girl!
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:lol My obie doeling looks the same way compared to my Saanen doeling. :really So, use the tapes and not "looks".
Kaye
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You have to remember that it takes really good management to get a kid from breeding to milking while growing. When new, and still tweaking your management around, and you don't have a set idea on what you are doing...the reasons for it I think would be better....than waiting until kids are at least 100 pounds would be better. 100 pounds of tall long lean, not 100 pounds and overweight and 7 months 
Vicki
VickiHi all...
Another factor to consider in readiness for breeding is development of the teat canal. Before sexual maturity, a doeling has an undeveloped teat canal. Afterwards, you can feel it as a discrete tube inside by gently pinching the teat. I wouldn't use this as the only criteria, but it's another way to check
Ellie
Another factor to consider in readiness for breeding is development of the teat canal. Before sexual maturity, a doeling has an undeveloped teat canal. Afterwards, you can feel it as a discrete tube inside by gently pinching the teat. I wouldn't use this as the only criteria, but it's another way to check
Ellie
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"Another factor to consider in readiness for breeding is development of the teat canal. Before sexual maturity, a doeling has an undeveloped teat canal. Afterwards, you can feel it as a discrete tube inside by gently pinching the teat. I wouldn't use this as the only criteria, but it's another way to check"
That is really interesting. I have never heard that before. A question--what role do the hormones of gestation play on this? I know in humans that prior to a completed pregnancy that breast tissue is undifferentiated to a large degree and it takes going through (not just starting) a pregnancy to cause full maturity. Is there any correlation that you know of in goats?
"100 pounds of tall long lean, not 100 pounds and overweight and 7 months"
Vicki is this a new approach of yours? You said something a few months ago about weaning, etc and rethinking weight and I have been chewing on it a while and wondering how (if) you were changing your management goals regarding this? Not that before you wanted them 100lbs and overweight at breeding, I KNOW that that is the same, but this thread triggered a recollection of you reconsidering weaning, ages, weights, eyc. What was I thinking of, do you recall?
That is really interesting. I have never heard that before. A question--what role do the hormones of gestation play on this? I know in humans that prior to a completed pregnancy that breast tissue is undifferentiated to a large degree and it takes going through (not just starting) a pregnancy to cause full maturity. Is there any correlation that you know of in goats?
"100 pounds of tall long lean, not 100 pounds and overweight and 7 months"
Vicki is this a new approach of yours? You said something a few months ago about weaning, etc and rethinking weight and I have been chewing on it a while and wondering how (if) you were changing your management goals regarding this? Not that before you wanted them 100lbs and overweight at breeding, I KNOW that that is the same, but this thread triggered a recollection of you reconsidering weaning, ages, weights, eyc. What was I thinking of, do you recall?
I don't know about the hormones and differentiating mammary tissue. I learned this technique from a judge at a show one time years ago (can't even remember who, now) but she showed us how to feel the difference in a mature teat canal and one that's not. I'll do some research...
Ellie
Ellie
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LeeAnnn it's sort of a do as I say not as I do really. New folks just simply don't have their nutritional management down to breed their does as young as I do, and not have problems. Waiting or really I think Tim's idea of bullying, just putting a young buck into the pen of does born the following year and freshening them as 18 month olds the next fall. Vicki
Wow! Thanks for all the info. The teat thing is different. For lots of various reason, I want to kid in May/June. That would make my doeling 2 yrs old if I wait. Is that ok?
On a slightly different note, I know that you should milk for as long as possible to keep does milking with long lactations throughout their lives. Is that just about drying off before breeding? If you have a doe freshen and say four months later wanted to breed her again, does that affect her lactation throughout her life? It also seems to be a bit of heavy breeding there.
I hope that makes a little sense.
On a slightly different note, I know that you should milk for as long as possible to keep does milking with long lactations throughout their lives. Is that just about drying off before breeding? If you have a doe freshen and say four months later wanted to breed her again, does that affect her lactation throughout her life? It also seems to be a bit of heavy breeding there.
I hope that makes a little sense.
I personally, would not breed a goat who has only been fresh for 4 months. I breed my later freshening yearlings at 5-6 months fresh for their second freshening (my April and May FF's to freshen in March to get on my program). They have not had problems with length of lactation in my herd. I don't run a commercial herd, however and like a month or two off from milking each winter.
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I agree with that statement. At 3-4mo. into a lactation, I know, here, my girls are not the best shape for breeding. Everything that goes into their body is being "run through" for milk. It's the toughest time on me(trying to manage production, keep weight on them to show, and not go too far over the edge) to even think of breeding them. I'd prefer them to be in the later stages of lactation, going down, and putting a little weight back on them. *Flushing* for easier breedings and healthier kids.
JMO
Kaye
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