Re: CIDRs-ongoing
Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 10:30 pm Post subject: Kaye-- CIDR timing?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey Kaye -- I know we talked about this last year, but what did you finally settle on for the length of time to leave the CIDR in? 21 days, or did you ever try the 14 day protocol?
I have some sitting in my fridge, so I guess I ought to try them this year at least, lol.
Tracy
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Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians
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Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:23 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for asking this Tracy, I was going to ask Kaye if she had anything new to add to what she was doing with CIDR's and PG600 or anything hocus pocus to add before I start breeding 13 in October and 9 in November!! OH THOSE ARE SCARY NUMBERS!!!! Vicki
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Kaye White
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1645
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Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2007 9:13 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, I was just looking over the doeling pen..scratching my head! How did I end up with soooo many doelings????
Tracy....being the pessimist that I am...The does I have CIDR'ed right now...before actual breeding season(swiss), I'm leaving in 21 days. Logical reasoning, they haven't cycled yet, I am hoping that with the 21 day, I get a viable (breeding) heat.
Now, I've got some that will get CIDRs in Oct., after they have cycled once.....those I plan to leave in 14 days and PG 600 them on the a.m. of the 14th day and pull CIDRs at the P.M. milking.
8) Hey, it worked last year! Both does that I CIDR'ed in August settled on the 1st breeding...and hadn't cycled before I put the CIDR's in.
Two does that I wanted to breed in late Oct. came into heat at the 14 day protocol, after cycling once, and they settled AI.
Vicki, I would think with Nubians...you could safely use the 14 days, since they cycle earlier than most breeds. Also remember to "wash" the CIDRs and re-use them. :wink:
Kaye
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Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians
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Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:07 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you Kaye, I will let you know how it works
All the girls have been in heat, so I like the idea of the 14 days. Yep I am washing and reusing, I have one that will have been used for the 3rd time in the same doe. Vicki
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Tracy in Idaho
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 462
Location: Southcentral Idaho
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 8:14 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ugh -- Kaye, I was just reviewing my notes from Biogenics' AI class, and I have down to Give the PG600 when you pull the CIDR?
Actually -- I have put CIDR in for 14 days, or at least 9 days.
Give lute 24 hrs before you pull CIDR.
Pull CIDR and give PG600.
Doe will be in heat 24 hours after you pull CIDR -- AI 24 hours after that.
Sooo--- you and Jonathan both do the give PG600 am and then pull CIDR pm?
Do they still come in 24 hours later? And you AI roughly 24 hours later?
Tracy :?
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Patty13637
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 915
Location: Jefferson County New York
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 8:38 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OK since you brought it up any place I can buy some cidr's?
thanks , Patty
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Kaye White
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1645
Location: Central Ark.
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 11:03 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tracy, why are you giving lute and PG 600? Both work the same.?? If your going to get a heat...you will get it with either. Seems like a waste to me.
I don't AI at a certain hr. from pulling CIDRs...I AI according to the does mucous and her individual cycle. ??
The does I've CIDR'ed in the past have generally been in standing heat at 24hrs. or 24hrs. from pulling the CIDR. Only doe I had that came in 3 days after pull, no longer resides here! She was hard to settle either way and I didn't have time to waste on her!
Patty try Biogenics and see if they have any. Last I heard...it was difficult to get them into the US.
Kaye
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Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians
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Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 6:32 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And have a decided on a PG600 dosage for this year
LOL!!! Vicki
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Kaye White
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Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 9:30 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm using 1 1/4cc per doe! I'm a little spooked about all the triplets I got last year! Especially since most will be 1st freshening yearlings! Would prefer twins outa' them!
AND, hee,hee...I can use one bottle on 4 does!
Kaye
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wheytogosaanens
Joined: 14 Sep 2006
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Location: North Idaho
Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 9:49 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cut and Pasted, Cut and Pasted, Now it's all in Word Perfect...(to the tune of Oh My Darling, Clementine).
Thanks for the good info Kaye.
Can't wait to learn to AI so I can use all of this good info!
Camille
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Camille O'Connor
Whey-to-Go Saanens/ Sables
Copper Penny Pyrenees
Copper Penny Boers (Home of the National Champion % Boer Doe)
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Tracy in Idaho
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 462
Location: Southcentral Idaho
Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 5:24 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kaye White wrote:
Tracy, why are you giving lute and PG 600? Both work the same.?? If your going to get a heat...you will get it with either. Seems like a waste to me.
Kaye
Not a clue! <g> I have it in my notes, and Teresa Wade has it in her advance repro paper as well -- http://www2.luresext.edu/goats/training/advrepro.pdf
Day 1: insert CIDR
Day 13: 2cc Lute
Day 14: 1.5 cc PG600/pull CIDR
Day 15: Does shows signs of estrus
Day 16: monitor and inseminate
I know they are on tour now, so I can't ask her -- I'll see her on the 30th though.
What PG600 dose did you do last year?
Tracy
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Kaye White
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
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Location: Central Ark.
Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:54 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last year I used 2 1/2cc per doe.
Kaye
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Sondra
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
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Location: Azle, TX
Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:57 pm Post subject:
Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians
Site Admin
I don't know how to open and copy a PDF format that Tracy just put up, but I guess we could just put the link up to Teresa's paper? If anyone knows how to copy to paste a PDF format tell me so we can have the paper readable on 101. Vicki
_________________
Lonesome Doe Nubians est: 1986
Nubian Soaps
lonesomedoenubians.com
:? This document has a locked security and states:
"You can not edit or copy this document."
Which I don't blame her....it's lots of work she's done and was gracious enough to post on the internet.
?? just put the link and let them go to it. It's great info.
Kaye
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Tracy in Idaho
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 462
Location: Southcentral Idaho
Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 7:18 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was actually surprised to find it online at all! You're right, that document had to have been a lot of work.
So any theories on why she says to do the lute as well as the PG600?
Tracy
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Old Dominion
Joined: 09 Apr 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Farnham, Virginia
Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:51 pm Post subject: Washing CIDR
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly how do you wash a CIDR?
Thanks -
Jolene
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Jolene Self
Old Dominion Dairy Goats
Farnham, Virginia
https://www.olddominiondairygoats.com/
Home of Kids A Lot IM Joshua, 2006 Premier Saanen Sire, who was sired by Windsor Manor AA Victor, 2004 Premier Saanen Sire.
We have a few quality kids for sale.
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Cotton Eyed Does
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 1700
Location: New Waverly, Texas
Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 6:00 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kaye didn't you say you went to a seminar or heard from someone that PG600 was determined to not be a super ovulator? Seems like we had that discussion last fall. Do you feel that it is? Well, I guess you do if you are cutting down the dosage. Just trying to get my facts straight. :wink:
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Cotton Eyed Does Dairy Goats
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Tracy in Idaho
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 462
Location: Southcentral Idaho
Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2007 7:14 am Post subject: Re: Washing CIDR
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Old Dominion wrote:
Exactly how do you wash a CIDR?
With a Novalsan solution
Chris, I'd think the PG600 has to be having a big effect on ovulation -- Jonathan wouldn't have gotten multiple sets of quints otherwise!
Tracy
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Southcentral Idaho
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[email protected]
Old Dominion
Joined: 09 Apr 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Farnham, Virginia
Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 3:19 pm Post subject: CIDRs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am getting ready to insert my first CIDRs. Please tell me what a "non irritating antiseptic solution" is for cleaning the applicator prior to insertion.
I am assuming that a "suitable veterinary obstetrical lube" is the same lube we use for AI.
Tracy told me to wash the CIDR in Novalsan solution prior to reuse. Does this mean dilute it? Do I need to rinse and air dry?
I am not quite as bad as the people you have to tell to take the plastic off of the pizza prior to putting it in the oven. But, I want to do this correctly. Any tidbits you could tell me would be great.
Thank you,
Jolene
Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 10:30 pm Post subject: Kaye-- CIDR timing?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey Kaye -- I know we talked about this last year, but what did you finally settle on for the length of time to leave the CIDR in? 21 days, or did you ever try the 14 day protocol?
I have some sitting in my fridge, so I guess I ought to try them this year at least, lol.
Tracy
_________________
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Southcentral Idaho
http://soldiermountainalpines.bravehost.com/
[email protected]
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Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians
Site Admin
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 3440
Location: North of Houston Texas
Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:23 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for asking this Tracy, I was going to ask Kaye if she had anything new to add to what she was doing with CIDR's and PG600 or anything hocus pocus to add before I start breeding 13 in October and 9 in November!! OH THOSE ARE SCARY NUMBERS!!!! Vicki
_________________
Lonesome Doe Nubians est: 1986
Nubian Soaps
lonesomedoenubians.com
Taking deposits on 2008 kids and young milkers.
Get put on the list for the $100 soaking wet buckling sale!
AKC Rhodesian Ridgebacks
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Kaye White
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1645
Location: Central Ark.
Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2007 9:13 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, I was just looking over the doeling pen..scratching my head! How did I end up with soooo many doelings????
Tracy....being the pessimist that I am...The does I have CIDR'ed right now...before actual breeding season(swiss), I'm leaving in 21 days. Logical reasoning, they haven't cycled yet, I am hoping that with the 21 day, I get a viable (breeding) heat.
Now, I've got some that will get CIDRs in Oct., after they have cycled once.....those I plan to leave in 14 days and PG 600 them on the a.m. of the 14th day and pull CIDRs at the P.M. milking.
8) Hey, it worked last year! Both does that I CIDR'ed in August settled on the 1st breeding...and hadn't cycled before I put the CIDR's in.
Two does that I wanted to breed in late Oct. came into heat at the 14 day protocol, after cycling once, and they settled AI.
Vicki, I would think with Nubians...you could safely use the 14 days, since they cycle earlier than most breeds. Also remember to "wash" the CIDRs and re-use them. :wink:
Kaye
_________________
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Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians
Site Admin
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 3440
Location: North of Houston Texas
Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:07 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you Kaye, I will let you know how it works
_________________
Lonesome Doe Nubians est: 1986
Nubian Soaps
lonesomedoenubians.com
Taking deposits on 2008 kids and young milkers.
Get put on the list for the $100 soaking wet buckling sale!
AKC Rhodesian Ridgebacks
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Tracy in Idaho
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 462
Location: Southcentral Idaho
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 8:14 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ugh -- Kaye, I was just reviewing my notes from Biogenics' AI class, and I have down to Give the PG600 when you pull the CIDR?
Actually -- I have put CIDR in for 14 days, or at least 9 days.
Give lute 24 hrs before you pull CIDR.
Pull CIDR and give PG600.
Doe will be in heat 24 hours after you pull CIDR -- AI 24 hours after that.
Sooo--- you and Jonathan both do the give PG600 am and then pull CIDR pm?
Do they still come in 24 hours later? And you AI roughly 24 hours later?
Tracy :?
_________________
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Southcentral Idaho
http://soldiermountainalpines.bravehost.com/
[email protected]
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Patty13637
Joined: 06 Sep 2006
Posts: 915
Location: Jefferson County New York
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 8:38 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OK since you brought it up any place I can buy some cidr's?
thanks , Patty
Back to top
Kaye White
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1645
Location: Central Ark.
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 11:03 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tracy, why are you giving lute and PG 600? Both work the same.?? If your going to get a heat...you will get it with either. Seems like a waste to me.
I don't AI at a certain hr. from pulling CIDRs...I AI according to the does mucous and her individual cycle. ??
The does I've CIDR'ed in the past have generally been in standing heat at 24hrs. or 24hrs. from pulling the CIDR. Only doe I had that came in 3 days after pull, no longer resides here! She was hard to settle either way and I didn't have time to waste on her!
Patty try Biogenics and see if they have any. Last I heard...it was difficult to get them into the US.
Kaye
_________________
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www.freewebs.com/tiviotoggs
Website updated 6/24/07
Taking reservations on 2008 kids
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Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians
Site Admin
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
Posts: 3440
Location: North of Houston Texas
Posted: Sat Sep 08, 2007 6:32 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And have a decided on a PG600 dosage for this year
_________________
Lonesome Doe Nubians est: 1986
Nubian Soaps
lonesomedoenubians.com
Taking deposits on 2008 kids and young milkers.
Get put on the list for the $100 soaking wet buckling sale!
AKC Rhodesian Ridgebacks
Back to top
Kaye White
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1645
Location: Central Ark.
Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 9:30 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm using 1 1/4cc per doe! I'm a little spooked about all the triplets I got last year! Especially since most will be 1st freshening yearlings! Would prefer twins outa' them!
AND, hee,hee...I can use one bottle on 4 does!
Kaye
_________________
Tivio Toggs
ADGA,DHIR,LA,AI,Show
www.freewebs.com/tiviotoggs
Website updated 6/24/07
Taking reservations on 2008 kids
Back to top
wheytogosaanens
Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 349
Location: North Idaho
Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 9:49 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cut and Pasted, Cut and Pasted, Now it's all in Word Perfect...(to the tune of Oh My Darling, Clementine).
Thanks for the good info Kaye.
Can't wait to learn to AI so I can use all of this good info!
Camille
_________________
Camille O'Connor
Whey-to-Go Saanens/ Sables
Copper Penny Pyrenees
Copper Penny Boers (Home of the National Champion % Boer Doe)
[email protected]
In beautiful North Idaho!
Back to top
Tracy in Idaho
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 462
Location: Southcentral Idaho
Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 5:24 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kaye White wrote:
Tracy, why are you giving lute and PG 600? Both work the same.?? If your going to get a heat...you will get it with either. Seems like a waste to me.
Kaye
Not a clue! <g> I have it in my notes, and Teresa Wade has it in her advance repro paper as well -- http://www2.luresext.edu/goats/training/advrepro.pdf
Day 1: insert CIDR
Day 13: 2cc Lute
Day 14: 1.5 cc PG600/pull CIDR
Day 15: Does shows signs of estrus
Day 16: monitor and inseminate
I know they are on tour now, so I can't ask her -- I'll see her on the 30th though.
What PG600 dose did you do last year?
Tracy
_________________
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Southcentral Idaho
http://soldiermountainalpines.bravehost.com/
[email protected]
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Kaye White
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1645
Location: Central Ark.
Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:54 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last year I used 2 1/2cc per doe.
Kaye
_________________
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Website updated 6/24/07
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Sondra
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 3388
Location: Azle, TX
Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:57 pm Post subject:
Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians
Site Admin
I don't know how to open and copy a PDF format that Tracy just put up, but I guess we could just put the link up to Teresa's paper? If anyone knows how to copy to paste a PDF format tell me so we can have the paper readable on 101. Vicki
_________________
Lonesome Doe Nubians est: 1986
Nubian Soaps
lonesomedoenubians.com
:? This document has a locked security and states:
"You can not edit or copy this document."
Which I don't blame her....it's lots of work she's done and was gracious enough to post on the internet.
?? just put the link and let them go to it. It's great info.
Kaye
_________________
Tivio Toggs
ADGA,DHIR,LA,AI,Show
www.freewebs.com/tiviotoggs
Website updated 6/24/07
Taking reservations on 2008 kids
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Tracy in Idaho
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 462
Location: Southcentral Idaho
Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 7:18 am Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was actually surprised to find it online at all! You're right, that document had to have been a lot of work.
So any theories on why she says to do the lute as well as the PG600?
Tracy
_________________
Soldier Mountain Alpines
Southcentral Idaho
http://soldiermountainalpines.bravehost.com/
[email protected]
Back to top
Old Dominion
Joined: 09 Apr 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Farnham, Virginia
Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:51 pm Post subject: Washing CIDR
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Exactly how do you wash a CIDR?
Thanks -
Jolene
_________________
Jolene Self
Old Dominion Dairy Goats
Farnham, Virginia
https://www.olddominiondairygoats.com/
Home of Kids A Lot IM Joshua, 2006 Premier Saanen Sire, who was sired by Windsor Manor AA Victor, 2004 Premier Saanen Sire.
We have a few quality kids for sale.
Back to top
Cotton Eyed Does
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 1700
Location: New Waverly, Texas
Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 6:00 pm Post subject:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kaye didn't you say you went to a seminar or heard from someone that PG600 was determined to not be a super ovulator? Seems like we had that discussion last fall. Do you feel that it is? Well, I guess you do if you are cutting down the dosage. Just trying to get my facts straight. :wink:
_________________
Christine Edwards
Cotton Eyed Does Dairy Goats
New Waverly, Texas
[email protected]
www.freewebs.com/cottoneyeddoes
TexStar Boer Goats
www.freewebs.com/texstarboers/
Back to top
Tracy in Idaho
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 462
Location: Southcentral Idaho
Posted: Wed Sep 12, 2007 7:14 am Post subject: Re: Washing CIDR
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Old Dominion wrote:
Exactly how do you wash a CIDR?
With a Novalsan solution
Chris, I'd think the PG600 has to be having a big effect on ovulation -- Jonathan wouldn't have gotten multiple sets of quints otherwise!
Tracy
_________________
Soldier Mountain Alpines
Southcentral Idaho
http://soldiermountainalpines.bravehost.com/
[email protected]
Old Dominion
Joined: 09 Apr 2007
Posts: 21
Location: Farnham, Virginia
Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2007 3:19 pm Post subject: CIDRs
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am getting ready to insert my first CIDRs. Please tell me what a "non irritating antiseptic solution" is for cleaning the applicator prior to insertion.
I am assuming that a "suitable veterinary obstetrical lube" is the same lube we use for AI.
Tracy told me to wash the CIDR in Novalsan solution prior to reuse. Does this mean dilute it? Do I need to rinse and air dry?
I am not quite as bad as the people you have to tell to take the plastic off of the pizza prior to putting it in the oven. But, I want to do this correctly. Any tidbits you could tell me would be great.
Thank you,
Jolene