AM I MAKING TOXIC WASTE??

Discussion in 'Soap Making' started by Anita Martin, Jun 28, 2008.

  1. Anita Martin

    Anita Martin Senior Member

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    I'm in the middle of a batch of soap....I beat for 15 minutes, and now I am resting for 5. This is my first all goat milk attemp. :/ I mixed the lye and milk slowly, and then stuck a frozen cooler icer thing in it when it began to turn orange. It cooled fairly fast...compared to water anyway. I got my oils to the right temp. and then combined them. The mess in the pan is a pumpkin orange color, and I can smell amonia fumes. This is the first time I have ever smelled amonia while making soap...this is my fourth batch. Am I making a nasty mess that will never be fit for use as soap? If so, I'm gonna throw the whole thing out while I am ahead instead of wasting 45 more minutes stirrring the batch...yes, I am using a hand blender. :help
    Thanks,
    Anita
     
  2. Anita Martin

    Anita Martin Senior Member

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    Well, whatever the outcome, it didn't get tossed. While I was on my 5 minute break, begging for help online, my pot of rubbish began to gel up. I still had 18 minutes left...and I managed to line my soap mold, add dried peppermint for texture, and some a lemony/citrusy blend EO that I mixed up. The batch is now darker colored than I wanted it, as I tried to put some in a pot and color it with cinnamon because I couldn't find anything else to cover up the orange with, and returned it to the main batch in the mold. I wanted a nice swirl, but that seemed to have failed...so now, with still 18 minutes left before my batches normally trace, my latest is sitting in it's mold in the oven, curing.

    What I am wondering is what is the best way to mix the lye and milk? Does it always turn orange? The soap left in my pan seems to have returned to a cream color. Stirring it with a can cooler did seem to help cool it very fast. My oils were not cooling quite as well, so I put them over the air-conditioner and they cooled down to around 120 fairly fast.

    Thanks for any input.
    Anita
     

  3. MRFBarbara

    MRFBarbara Guest

    Hi Anita,
    Did you use the milk right out of the fridge, could be why it turned orange.. I freeze my goat milk and then add lye, the heat from the lye will melt it and it won't burn the milk proteins.. Your soap is usuable even if you did turn the milk orrange.. and amonia smell is common in soaps and usually goes away in a day or two..
    But it sounds as tho your mix was way too hot if it cooled down to 120 in air conditioning.. I soap at room temp or barely 100 and use frozen goat milk.. try freezing your milk and having your molds lined and ready to go before you mix the soap.
    Each batch of soap will act different and cannot be timed, different oils will react different with different temps and fragrance oils will also react different each and every time depending on oils used, temp of soap etc..
    So next batch, try having additives, molds, and fragrance measured out and ready to go.. Have milk frozen and broken up in chunks to add lye to and try to melt solid oils slowly and keep temp under 100...Add all together and stick blend... What recipe were you using, post it so I can look at it and run thru lye calculator..
    Barbara
     
  4. Kalne

    Kalne New Member

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    When I do all milk I freeze my milk in ice cubes so it does not turn orange at all. I just sprinkle the lye on top then stir while it all melts down.

    I don't know why you would have to mix for so long though. Esp. with a hand blender. Most of mine are ready in 5-10 minutes.
     
  5. Anita Martin

    Anita Martin Senior Member

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    What a great idea! I had thought of that, but since I bought some books, and they told me another way.. I thought I could not do it! Phew! what a relief! The one I am thinking of is Casey Makela's book "Milk Based Soaps". She says to fill the sink with ice and put your pot of milk and lye into the ice water in the sink. My freezer can't make that much ice and so i took the short cut of using a frozen can cooler to swirl around in the milk. Next time I'll use frozen milk or milk cubes for sure. The amonia scent seems to have gone and I can smell the EO's so it's possibly okay....despite the odd color for a citrus soap.
     
  6. Sondra

    Sondra New Member

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    yep always freeze your milk and pour your lye in very slowly as the milk melts.
     
  7. Anita Martin

    Anita Martin Senior Member

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    If I had more oils I'd make another batch to try it out just as soon as my milk freezes. I've now got a freezer full of pre-measured goat milk. I was surprised this last recipe traced so fast. Usually it's been taking me at least 45 minutes. I guess because I used different oils? No lard or crisco this time. Ran out. Has anyone tried the log molds from Brambleberry? They are very expensive I know, but they sure look a lot easier than what I've been using, and the fact that the sides fall away, and that there is a special cutter designed just for the mold is a great idea in my book. My bars are kind of uneven and cut crooked. I used a slab mold that I had sprayed with Pam and the soap still would not release even after several days. I had to pry it out, which messed it up, so i had to REALLY trim those bars. They are a lot smaller now than they should be, but they smell nice! I've got all my soaps set out to cure in my 21 year old sons room, which is actually a double room. His room sure does smell nice now! :biggrin :biggrin
    Anita
     
  8. Sheryl

    Sheryl New Member

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    Anita, if you have wood molds, line them with parchment paper, the soap comes out, the paper peels off, and you can cut your soap. I am soo very new to soap making, but go into the recipe section and do the wal mart recipe. It is just about as no fail as you can get. I dont even hardly melt my lard and stuff, just barely get it soft and plop all that stuff together (using the frozen milk/lye method) and stick blend, just at trace, I put in my FO's EO's and whatever else I want to put in. Be sure to use a lye calculator. It will turn out every time (or just about).

    Happy soap making :biggrin

    Sheryl
     
  9. Anita Martin

    Anita Martin Senior Member

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    Yes, i did use the walmart recipe, but I had to substitute oils...so maybe it was no longer the walmart recipe??? I've been lining my wooden molds (boxes) with freezer paper, which works well, although it's hard to get it in the corners good because it is so thick...where do you get parchment paper? The slab style mold is a clear plastic tray that has soap bar outlines raised up on the bottom. I tried using paper with it, but the shapes did not show through, so when I used it again I used Pam. Maybe I just didn't use enough? I also have a small star try made form silicon. That is a really cool mold. The soaps just pop right out. The star shape makes no sense though. When I bought it I thought it was tiny little stars, but they are big stars and I can't imagine they would feel nice to bathe with. But they are cute!
    Anita
     
  10. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

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    You need to throw that book as far away as you can :)

    You had 18 minutes left, I got a great chuckle out of that. It's a chemical reaction you can't control it. Everything reacts to it...and OMG the putting the frozen PLASITC ice thingy into it! You are lucky the lye didn't eat right through it! :)

    Parchment is right next to the ziplock and foil at wallmart, ours is stuck behind a pole so you have to look for it :)

    Also you might want to try a garbage bag, they are super easy also, just smooth out the wrinkles and tape it to the back of the mold. To make it easier cut a piece of cardboard the same size as the mold so you can just set it in the bottom, sandwiching the plastic and your mold. Tape your side and then remove your cardboard.

    You will never have pretty soap until you freeze your milk. Vicki
     
  11. MRFBarbara

    MRFBarbara Guest

    Anita, if you used the walmart recipe and subsituted oils, you must run this thru a calculator.. different oils have different sap values and it takes a different amount of lye for the proper chemical reaction..
    Throw out everything you know about making soap now and follow the directions on the walmart recipe area and get a scale.. After that things will go much easier for you..Promise
    Barbara
    PS you don't need any oils, just make a simple unscented oatmeal Milk and honey soap, they smell great.. Add oatmeal (ground) and honey at trace.. 1 tablespoon per pound of oils
     
  12. Anita Martin

    Anita Martin Senior Member

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    Yes, I did run the recipe through the lye calculator at thesage.com. I'm thinking seriously about throwing that book someplace....maybe one of the goats would like to eat it? Barbara, can I make soap without oil???? What do I use in it's place? I "knew I had 18 minutes left before starting to trace, because I was timing the batch, based on the other batches I made and timed....just to get a feel for how long this was going to take. For the last couple batches I waited until after I had stirred for 15 minutes (as per instructions on thesage.com) to line my molds because the time passed soooooooo slowwwww. I like the idea about the carboard in the bottom and sandwhiching a garbage bag between the cardboard and the mold. I'll DEFINATELY try that one next time!
    Thanks everyone! My soap is ugly....really ugly, but it had the most lovely smell this morning. I could smell it even though it was still wrapped up. I'm off to Walmart this evening to get more oils (unless I can figure out how to make soap without them??) and will look for the parchment, the oatmeal and some honey. Sounds yummy!
    Anita
     
  13. Anita Martin

    Anita Martin Senior Member

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    oh yes, I DO have a scale, and ALWAYS use it! Oz, grams, pounds, etc. Very expensive and it works quite well.
     
  14. MRFBarbara

    MRFBarbara Guest

    Sorry Anita, I meant fragrance oils or EO's .. My mistake.. nope you cannot make soap without basic oils.. once you get this soap making down, you will love it.. I love to make soap
    Barbara
     
  15. NubianSoaps.com

    NubianSoaps.com New Member

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    Well except butters :) 100% lard soaps are wonderful. Warning...they last forever and you will loose repeat sales as the hard creamy bars last FOREVER!!!! Vicki
     
  16. Anita Martin

    Anita Martin Senior Member

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    Oh darn. I was thinking bananas, cabbage, flour, etc. :sigh Oh shoot. Well, I GOT NEW OILS! I have plenty of frangrance and essential oils. I was out of basic soap making oils and butters. Went by Walmart this evening. I was so excited to blend my milk with the lye and make 100% goat milk soap. And it WORKED! In fact, I had so much fun, I made TWO batches! The first one I used just ground oatmeal, milk, and honey.....with about 1 tsp of honey scent added just because I couldn't stop myself. I promised one of the horses I trim that I would make her some lavender soap because she hates regular horse shampoo and loves lavender, especially the essential oil that I brought last time.....so I made Grace her batch of soap too. I put ground oatmeal in it and not quite one ounce of EO..the batch was only 3.5 pounds.
    My best friend called me tonight and said she took a shower with the rosemary soap I gave her and she LOVES it. I thought it was much too strong. I colored it with thyme, and added dried, crushed, basil. It is quite strong indeed...my mom wants some too, and so do several of the people at work....I just wish my bars looked better. I have yet to find the perfect way to cut them. Meanwhile, I have two nice batches curing in the oven. Oh, is a light yellow okay when mixing the frozen goat milk with the lye? I am using those ball plastic freezer jars to freeze my milk. I put 16 oz in each one, and then add 4 oz of milk from an ice cube tray. I can't seem to break up those 16 oz pieces, and am wondering if that is why my lye/milk mixture is turning slightly yellow, or is this normal? My soap traced really fast and easy, and had just a slight amount of fuming to it. I am very happy with my new way of soaping. THANKS TO EVERYONE HERE WHO GAVE ME GOOD ADVICE! I used garbage bags and a paper lined cardboard to line the molds....the one thing I forgot at Walmart was the parchment paper, but I have plenty of freezer paper.
    Okay, it's stopped raining. I have no excuse now not to get outside and feed the horses and milk the goats. Darn. Now I know what I can do all winter...MAKE SOAP! How fun! :biggrin
     
  17. MRFBarbara

    MRFBarbara Guest

    Wonderful, so glad it worked for you.. and yes it is normal for it to turn a slight yellow when mixing lye and milk together..
    Happy Soaping
    Barbara
     
  18. kidsngarden

    kidsngarden New Member

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    I freeze my milk in ice cube trays so it is nice and small already and I weigh it out each batch. I tried the freezer bag and whacking it on the counter, but when I chipped my tile trim while doing it I stopped.

    Sometimes it can get yellow, but most of the time it stays white for me. Yellow is no big deal though. Having it in smaller chunks will keep it whiter.
     
  19. Ravens Haven

    Ravens Haven New Member

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    Do you all weigh your milk first and then put in to ice trays or freeze in ice trays and weigh later when you are ready to make soap?

    Anita, so glad your soap turned out fine.

    Autumn
     
  20. kidsngarden

    kidsngarden New Member

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    I don't weigh before I freeze. I freeze it in cubes, store them in a gallon size freezer bag and weigh out the cubes. Sometimes I'm just over by a couple 10ths of an ounce or something - but that certainly doesn't affect much.

    We drink raw milk here and if it gets goaty it is relegated to soaping milk and frozen in the cubes right away unless I am soaping a batch that day that is not 100% goats milk, then I let it come to RT and just add it after emulsification like Vicki does.