Planting for Winter Pasture

[Anita Martin]

I want to grow some winter forage for the goats this year.  I'm thinking of winter rye or oats or a combination of things, maybe some hairy vetch too.  When is the best time to plant these grasses?  Our small pastures are sparely grassed, is it okay to plant a pasture grass along with them?  Should I plant annual grains or perinneal?  I live in southern/central Virginia.  We've gotten tons of rain lately, is it too early to plant for winter forage? 

Any other things I can plant this fall that might provide some winter nutrition?

[billinohio]

Here in Ohio, some of the grass-based cow dairies use forage turnips (they grow very large green tops!!)......a couple of the farmers that I know were still grazing turnips in December.  They said that the "key" to success with turnips is getting rain at the right time.

here is an article:
http://hayandforage.com/mag/farming_turnips_tops_late/

Here is a seed company;
http://www.barusa.com/barusa/EN/other-crops_2999.php?siteid=1001&page=product&segmentid=274&productid=892&product=Barkant+Turnip&tabblad=productoverzicht&country=0

[Anita Martin]

Oh yes, I'd heard about the turnips too.  Thanks for the links! 

[Anita Martin]

Hey Bill I did some research on the turnips and found a lot of good info.  I've got a small plot I'm going to try them in...some of it is not going to be tilled before planting.  It seems that a lot of folks are interested in growing fodder.  When I was at the feed co-op asking about the seeds they had the guy there told me they'd sold A LOT of pounds of the turnip and rape seeds since they'd gotten them in by the bulk load.  I only bought a pound of turnips seeds as that's all I have room for, and they were really inexpensive. 

The goats are amazing at pasture clean up.  I've only got two small pastures fenced right now, the balance of the property is in woods. The cleared area is maybe two acres...I'm terrible at estimating acreage.  The horses ate all the grass and left tons of baby trees and weeds growing.  Turning the goats out there, either with or without the horses has really been turning those small areas around.  The one side looked like hell after having 5 horses on it for a couple of months.  I took them off, the chickens turned the horse piles to nothing, and the goats ate every single weed that had sprouted up and now the pasture is beautiful.  The grass is growing thicker, etc.  I've got horses back on it, but it's still looking good and NO weeds growing!

It's hard sometimes to get the chickens interested in going out there, away from the protection of the barnyard and scratching through the piles of horse manure.  I'm going to start feeding whole grains to the horses just so they'll poop em out and entice the chickens!

[doublebowgoats]

That's a good deal Anita. When the goats have been working on a place I always think it looks like a park. Do you have before and after pictures?

[Faye Farms]

In September we are planting cool season grasses with a cover crop of winter wheat.  The wheat sprouts up quick so it will beat out the weeds so the cool season grasses can grow better.  We will also be able to graze off the wheat this winter/spring.  We've grown turnips for the cows too.  Great stuff!  There are some farms north of me that plant corn in the summer and then go through when the corn is about half grown and drop turnip seeds from an airplane.  After the corn has been harvested the turnips really take off.  I saw the fattest most gorgeous beef cows out there grazing in turnips that were up to their bellies.  It was amazing! 

[Vicki McGaugh Tx Nubians]

So are the root part of the turnips wasted on the goats...would be cool to run some pigs through if I didn't hate pigs running around my place more than I detest chickens doing the same  

Anyone is the south doing anything cool for winter/early spring pastures? 

[Cotton Eyed Does]

I just do the same old thing every year but it grows beautifully here.  I plant Gulf Rye all over the goat pasture.  I usually go out and mow down the pasture then I just come back with buckets and strow it out by the handfulls, just sling it up into the wind.  Sometimes if my back hurts I ride the lawnmower and set the bucket in between my legs on the mower and sling it up into the air to cover the pasture.  I never have to fertilize it.  There is always enough cow, horse, goat and chicken poop that has been in that pasture from time to time over the year during rotations that it is never needed.  It grows nearly butt deep to the goats and gives them plenty to eat.  What they don't eat down during the winter I let either the cows or horses in on it before it gives way to the heat.  I usually plant late September or October depending on how hot it is and the rain fall situation.  Last year the rye was running $24.00 a sack and I usually use 2 bags.

[Faye Farms]

So are the root part of the turnips wasted on the goats...would be cool to run some pigs through if I didn't hate pigs running around my place more than I detest chickens doing the same  
Anyone is the south doing anything cool for winter/early spring pastures? 

You would be surprised how many roots the cows pull up with the tops.  They then eat the whole thing.  The nice thing about the turnips is that if they don't pull up the root the turnip top will grow back. 

[Cotton Eyed Does]

Hey Bill,
that seed company link seemsto be a bad link.  I can't get it to go through.

[buckrun]

We plant a mixture of winter rye grass- vetch and clover as soon as the night temps drop below 65 and it looks like rain.  We let it grow for about 60 days with no grazing and then fertilize and start grazing.  We go through very little hay with terrific milk production from all that green stuff all winter.  They only eat hay on rainy days or while in confinement for kidding.  Most years 25 does only use 100 bales.  The price of the seed and fertilizer is so worth them serving themselves! 

[Tim Pruitt]

Hi Lee,
What month do you usually plant this mix?   I plan to do something this year myself in several parcels of land.

[buckrun]

We wait until night temps stay below 65 because the seeds will not reliably break dormancy in large numbers untill then. You can seed any time and they will sit there but the birds will find them eventually.
We watch the weather and try to seed right before a storm to cut down on that happening.
Last year it was the beginning of Oct.  We have planted as late as December in drought years and that turned into late winter early spring graze. Normally we can count on a sprouting rain and cooler night temps by October.
We plant too much area to water it ourselves but if you are doing small patches you could run a rain bird on it to speed things up.  Good luck.  We love this method of winter feeding.  We always did it with our Brangus herd and the goats did well on it too.  We don't plant wheat because of grass tetany.

If it gets growing well enough you will have to cut it back in spring to clear the way for the new spring perennials to get going. The rye will look wimpy at first but after you let them start cropping it off it will get wider blades and stronger growth. You may want to ask your county agent about the best variety for you.  We had a discussion about this last year I think and there were some good tips about improved types with wider blades.  I think someone on here mentioned Marshall as a good one.
http://overton.tamu.edu/library/files/GrazingSchoolAnnualRyegrass.pdf
http://www.ryegrass.com/Annual_Rye_brochure.pdf

[rebeccasminis]

We are planting barley as it is a great cooling grain for goats.  It will grow a bit now and go a bit dormant and be growing in the spring, I also planted some spring and midsummer for them but mostly they just graze the fenceline and take out the briars, trees, weeds and whatnot that the cows dont.  I feed comfrey through the winter as well.  It dyes back but it easy to dry and give them in the morning.  After christmas there is too much snow to reach much ont he ground and they go for browse and trees.  I love reading the replies, I now have a few new ideas!!

[trueblessings]

Didn't think goats were to eat hairy vetch. It's listed as a toxic plant here.

[buckrun]

There are 140 species called Vetch.  Several are commonly seeded in forage mixes.
Our goats love it and have shown no negative reactions.
We use what is called common vetch- it is vicia sativa.
vicia villosa is hairy vetch and the common name is  Fodder Vetch so perhaps there are problems if it is the only thing they are eating or is over fertilized since it accumulates nitrogen but normally it is used as a small part of a mix.
It is less than 10 percent of our overseeding mixture for winter pasture.

[rebeccasminis]

Tomatoes are listed as poisonous to goats as well....and they are part of the nightshade family but I have a doe who if she can will mow tomato plants down one right after the other...and never shows any ill effects...Niggies seem to have bellies of steel.  We just seeded with the turnips, and rye with barley mixed in.  We shall see how it makes it!

[Ashley]

There are a lot of toxic plants I see my goats eating. Poke, acorns even that Perilla Mint. The last one gives me the heebie jeebies, but I read it's medicinal, I guess as long as they have plenty of other stuff to eat they won't eat enough to be toxic.

[rebeccasminis]

Poke is supposed to be good for anything related to breasts in humans so I imagine it would be great for mastitis...maybe they are self medicating? preventative? who knows, goats are quite good at eating exactly what they want but I have as yet for any to get sick, knock on wood, so I will continue to let them eat as they see fit.  Acorns increase production at all?

[buckrun]

Please be sure you put out baking soda and teach them to use it if you plan to let them eat acorns.  We do each year as we have acres of huge mature oaks and it is great food but it does tend to make them acidic.  We limit the time each day in the woods once acorns begin to fall. And we make sure the soda trays are full.

Please do not be insulted but you need to know that goats are not good at self medicating.  They will strip an azalea bush to the ground and die while thinking how yummy that was so don't think because they like things that are classed as medicinal in small amounts that they can self medicate.  Maybe some wild goats on the Anatolian plateau but not the modern dairy goat which is totally a human construct.  They do not have instincts about plants that a seriously wild ruminant has.

It is true that a free ranging animal on a wide territory that has a varied plant community can medicate themselves but it is an acquired skill as they have to have time for the chemical feedback after eating and processing the forage.  If they die before learning....well you get the picture